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Is the ESL / EFL Industry Racist?
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Is the ESL/EFL Industry Racist?
Yes
67%
 67%  [ 19 ]
No
7%
 7%  [ 2 ]
It's a Regional Thing
25%
 25%  [ 7 ]
Total Votes : 28

Author Message
gelynch52



Joined: 26 Nov 2005
Posts: 3
Location: Tagaytay, The Philippines

PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2005 4:24 pm    Post subject: beards Reply with quote

I'm not so sure about the beard thing. In my experience it will be very difficult to get a job in either Korea or Japan with a beard. It would be my recomendation to get the job, establish yourself as competent, be liked by the students and management & then grow a beard over an extended holiday like (Chinese) New Year or Chusok (in Korea). Then once you have it you will not be fired for having it but I am quite sure you will not make any new friends that way (especially girlfriends in the romantic sense).
Confused Ladies are hard to come by in Korea unless one is of the same age group. Since I am in my 50s it is virtually impossible to get a date.
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Supergussy



Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2005 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

>>>Hey Supergussy...your'e wrong. The industry is racist.<<<

Firstly, I'd suggest you re-read my original post related to the context of that to which I was responding. I agree that the industry does seem to be racist. I don't think the teaching of English is isolated, as the problems would seem to stem largely from the old "native teachers are best" philosophy, which is present in the teaching of all languages. What I do not believe to be a fair generalisation, is that the UK is somehow more racist than other countries when it comes to recruiting non-native or non-white native teachers. If we wish to compare nations in terms of racism we must be very clear as to what standard we are comparing them against. How do we define racism, when what constitutes racism varies between nation, region, race, culture and class?

Secondly, I am not so much calling for teachers to unite against racism as posing the question as to what, if anything, we can do to overcome the racism that we DO find in relation to our industry on an individual level. Should we, as teachers, be in part responsible for attempting to change the attitudes of our students (and/or colleagues) toward race and racism? And, if the answer is "yes", how can we do something to help make such a change?

Thirdly, I would like to point out that some of the assumptions members have made about me (both here and via my email) are entirely incorrect. Racism, like all prejudice stems from a lack of information and understanding. In the same way that to assume a person of Oriental appearance is unqualified as an English teacher, it is quite wrong to assume that someone who speaks against racism is some kind of left-wing tree hugger intent on saving the world. Anybody here willing to make such sweeping generalistaions on the minimal amount of my personal information that is available via this site would be better examining their own attitudes before making allegations of prejudice against anyone else, let alone an entire nation.

Angus
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Scooby *Scott* Doo



Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 43

PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2005 5:40 pm    Post subject: Let's unite Reply with quote

Well, why don't we unite then as teachers? I mean for starters we need to kick out the bums who run the slave driving language schools. Aren't they the real racists? I mean they hire, so they decide who works, and they could easily hire on the basis of non-discrimination, but they choose not to. So to the devile with them! That's what I say. They arbitrarily fire on the base of race too, I've seen it. Come to think of it, there are some Univesity programs that do the same too. Basically all employers when it comes down to it.

Is there some international union of teachers I could join that actively fights discrimination among teachers?
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Lee Hobbs
Site Admin


Joined: 08 Dec 2005
Posts: 141
Location: TheGulfCoast

PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 8:39 pm    Post subject: ESL Whiskers & Anti-Beardist Behaviours Reply with quote

Quote:
In my experience it will be very difficult to get a job in either Korea or Japan with a beard


Johnson, Thomas and Gelynch,

Sorry to get so off-topic, but this thing about the Texas Ranger-style beard just has me floored! Laughing



I mean, come on now, who wouldn't hire this guy in a New York second as an ESL teacher? I think I'd feel a lot safer, lol.

It's just gotta be that fantastic beard!

Seriously though, good comments everyone. Let's do address the subject of racism (or beardism) whether the fault can be found with the ESL employers themselves or in the base market (for which the ESL employers will eventually submit to in order to get the business). I mean, as wrong as it is, can we really expect business to go against what the market demands?

In addition to the agist issues already being discussed in a different place on this ESL forum, my guess is, there are probably sexist issues as well at work in the ESL world. If the clientele is demanding one gender over another, do you think ESL employers will turn a blind eye and appeal to some higher moral code? Why do you think photos are often requested/required in C.V. applications? In the West, cross-dressers, for example, might (or might not) enjoy a certain degree of civil liberty equality with anti-discrimination laws, but how many cross-dressing ESL teachers have you spotted working overseas? Perhaps this warrants a separate forum category.

Carry on posters. Will be interested to see how this discourse develops further.

May social justice always prevail,

Lee

http://www.esl-lesson-plan.com

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Wocca



Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Posts: 46
Location: China / Chile

PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2006 9:39 am    Post subject: Fairly neutral accents also required ... Reply with quote

HenanMike wrote:
...The Chinese prefer to hire Caucasians from Canada, U.S.A., G.B., N.Z. and Australia. Only slightly behind would be black people from those countries if they are native speakers..."

Whenever I've read advertisements for
"foreign" teachers, a preference is given
to native-English-speakers from native-
English-speaking countries, with fairly
neutral accents.

Those countries tend to be : Shocked
USA - UK - Eire - Australia - NZ - Canada
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aardvark



Joined: 21 Jul 2008
Posts: 181
Location: Central Saudi Arabia

PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 7:39 am    Post subject: racism vs. willing partcipation in wage slavery Reply with quote

I just interviewed with UCLA as an ESL teacher in their university extension program. I had to drive 90 minutes in CA heat, pay $18 for parking and interview with a non-native English speaker who corrected my pronunciation of "Celce-Murcia" as I tried to make the best impression. I thought I had nailed the interview. I was sent to the Admin building to get processed, have my ID and social security card copied and all that.

One week later, they haven't called and I feel like a jilted girlfriend after a one-night stand (he didn't call!). If the director wanted a pool of applicants for the job, why didn't she say so?

This brings up the question of racism vs. participation in wage slavery. Racism is the refuge of the unqualified over their non-selection (at least that's the way it appears in the USA). Wage slavery (which is a better term for rampant illegal immigration) is the engine that propels the wages of ESL teachers (and others) down. It really is a race to the bottom. One of the posters mentioned unionization, and I would favor this if only it would work in the USA.
I have seen my future as a part-time ESL teacher who works here and there and never seems to be able to save enough money for retirement because there is ALWAYS someone who is willing to work for less. How do I break the cycle? I am thinking about leaving ESL and I am not a happy camper. Sad
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JamesAtRealize



Joined: 09 Sep 2010
Posts: 118
Location: Kobe, Sanomiya, Japan

PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm one of the least racist guys on the face of the earth, I'm not sexist or ageist either in any way.

Funny thing is though, that as an employer in Japan, I feel myself fighting against myself on who to hire. I've known many non-white people who are much better at english than I, and yet... economically I know it's foolish for me to hire anyone other than a White Woman in her Twenties or early Thirties...

I feel like such a hypocrite lol, as much as I know it's horrible not to stand up for what I believe. I would never expect any student-base to see it the way I do, and that's what I have to consider most when hiring.
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Trinie



Joined: 19 Jan 2012
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:00 pm    Post subject: LOOKING WHITE Reply with quote

I find it sad that many countries think that anyone that can teach or speaks English well, is someone who is "white" looking. They seem to discriminate against Asian Americans and others who don't look white. I experienced that and I'm so sad and disheartened... I wonder, at times, if I will ever find a job overseas? I thought that there was a need for English teachers? I guess they don't believe that those who don't look white cannot speak or teach English well... What a close minded way of thinking...
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